The Morning Formation Podcast
Hosted by KP Phillips—a U.S. Army combat veteran, former law enforcement officer, and seasoned instructor in tactics, firearms, and combatives—The Formation Podcast is built on the core pillars of Survivability, Situational Awareness, and the mindset to Adapt & Overcome.
Drawing from over two decades of real-world experience in combat zones and high-risk environments, KP leads authentic conversations with warriors, protectors, and everyday individuals who’ve faced adversity head-on. This podcast is more than content—it's a movement for those who understand that the fight begins before the event.
Through storytelling, lived experience, and expert insight, The Formation Podcast equips its listeners with the mindset, tools, and awareness to remain vigilant and prepared—whether on the battlefield, in the streets, or in everyday life.
The Morning Formation Podcast
Ibogaine, Psychedelics, Trauma, And A New Path For Military Veterans & First Responders
We sit down with Andrew of Freedom Ibogaine to unpack addiction, PTSD, and why some veterans find hope in medically supervised psychedelic care in Mexico. We cover safety, screening, longer stays for integration, and how community turns a reset into a real change.
• why ibogaine can reduce cravings and quiet fight or flight
• limits of conventional rehab and insurance-driven care
• how careful screening and magnesium protocols reduce risk
• what the “gray day” is and why integration begins before dosing
• the role of community, therapy, yoga, and sweat lodge
• differences between ibogaine, Bufo, and ayahuasca
• emerging research on TBI, neuroplasticity, and mood stability
• privacy protections and the legal landscape for veterans
• who is not a candidate and common medication contraindications
• why longer stays help turn insight into daily practice
“Stay tuned, stay focused, and stay motivated.”
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Episode Powered By Act Now Education
Warriors, fall in, it's time for formation. Today, Formation Nation, we're diving into the topic that's raw, real, and hitting our veteran community hard addiction, trauma, and the search for healing after the uniform comes off. Our guest today, Andrew, represents Freedom Abragain, a medically supervised Abergain treatment program operating out of Mexico. They work with veterans and first responders who feel stuck, broken, or trapped in cycles of pain. And they use controversial yet emerging treatments to help people confront what traditional methods sometimes can't reach. Today we're not promoting, endorsing, or advocating, we're learning. We're exploring and we're talking about one of the toughest battles our people face, and that's the battle within. So I'm absolutely honored to have you on the program here, Andrew. Thank you so much for giving me your time because there's so many people out there that have so many questions.
SPEAKER_00:Thank you, man.
SPEAKER_01:We just basically want to separate the facts from the myths, talk about uh your experiences, get to know who you are a little bit, let people um understand and relate to you and why you're passionate about doing this. So thank you for being on the show. You're welcome.
SPEAKER_00:Thank you for having me.
SPEAKER_01:Just to kick things off, Andrew, I want to talk about who you are. Would you mind just telling our community a little bit about yourself, where you come from, and what are the trials and tribulations you've been through?
SPEAKER_00:Yes, uh, my name's Andrew. I own Freedom I Begain. I'm from Dallas, Texas originally. Um, I was in the music business for a long time, and that during that process I developed a severe drug addiction. And um you know, not not because of the music, just I think it's a spiritual malady, and you know, it got very unmanageable. And in 2018, I came out here to do Ibegain. I didn't know hardly anything about it. Um, I'd been to traditional recovery centers, rehab centers over and over again. I wanted to get clean, but I couldn't. Um it just kept pulling me. And uh, you know, after coming out here in March of 2018, I've never relapsed, I've never had a craving for my drug of choice, and it changed my life. And I've been here ever since. The center I went to um asked me to stay on as a volunteer, and then I became a partner, and here I am. So it's been life-changing.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, you know, I think a lot of people I talk about this on the show quite a bit. A lot of people assume that life is supposed to be perfect and polished, but we all have potholes that we've hit along the way, we've had uh breakdowns, we've we've we're like mechanically, we've we've gone through what's called life, and I think we many times try to portray things as perfect, but um the important part is failing forward and always getting better, right? Absolutely. If you're working on yourself, you know, and trying to do better, you're doing good. And when you went through all those rehab facilities, um did you feel like some of them were kind of set up to help you return back to them? Did you feel like that it was kind of like a cycle? Because at the end of the day, a lot of times, you know, they put chemicals into your drinks and things like that to get you to to drink more, right? So do you think rehab facilities, some of the ones you went to, were kind of set up to bring you back?
SPEAKER_00:I think that they probably were. Um I didn't really have that experience there, but I do I do feel like they were. Um I was a uh severe stimulant addict, so there wasn't really any meds they can give me to stabilize. I mean, you go in and you just have to lay there. Um, but I I saw the cycle going on, and they would always try to get me on psych meds and different sleeping meds, and they don't that they don't agree with me. Um so I never got got onboarded that way, but I saw it for sure. And I I saw the insurance companies dictating um people's treatment path. So you know, at the end of the day, the case manager at the rehab has to report to the insurance representative they did this, this, this, and this today in order to get paid. So it's like uh who who's treating you, the rehab or the insurance company. So it's kind of a cookie gutter thing.
SPEAKER_01:I've personally known quite a few people that have gone through rehab of different sorts, and it's to me it seems like a very low success rate overall.
SPEAKER_00:Many.
SPEAKER_01:So I think if people are gonna take mental health seriously, we need to start looking at other avenues because uh what do they call the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over again and having the same results. And that's why Exactly. When I read across your Instagram, I was like, I want to find out like a little bit more about who this guy is and what he does, and just my curiosity. And over the years, talking to so many veterans and PTSD folks um that are suffering from that have talked about the psychedelic route. So, for those out there who are unfamiliar, what exactly is ibogaine and how does your program at Freedom Ibogaine differ from other detox and trauma treatment facilities?
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. Ibogaine is a natural medicine that's extracted from iboga, uh, which is a plant native to Central West Africa, Gabon, Cameroon, Guinea, parts of the Congo. Um Ibogaine's also extracted from another plant called Vokenga. Um, what Ibogaine does is it resets your central nervous system. And for addiction and addiction pathways, it clears the pathways out of your brain. So, you know, you have somebody who's detoxing, they're craving drugs. Um after Ibogaine treatment, those cravings are are eliminated or greatly reduced. So that's that's that's how it kind of came to the forefront. Um you know, originally as an addiction medicine. But what it does is it resets your central nervous system in a in a really profound way. And that's that's why it's helping so many veterans, first responders, um, because it can deactivate somebody from from being in that activated fight or flight mode, that that those that cortisol pump that's running. Um you know, you have somebody that's generally you know, it incredibly stressed out, physically stressed out, all the time from from trauma, PTSD, and and and the trials and tribulations that so many veterans and and first responders go through. And Ivy gain gives them the opportunity to breathe. So yeah, you know, it just it slows everything down and it has a really beautiful ability to turn off ruminating, where you, you know, that machine that spins in in all of our heads. Um it it it brings you, it can bring you into a really beautiful right now state where um instead of tripping about the future all the time or worried this is gonna happen or that's gonna happen, um, it it it it just slows it down. And then it it also, you know, the negative self-talk that a lot of a lot of people do, a lot of us, everybody does, it has the ability to turn that off too. Where if you're thinking about the past or thinking about stuff you've been through, instead of beating yourself up and and being nasty to yourself, um you analyze it and dissect it and go, wait, wait a minute. This this pattern that I've developed because of this incident here has now now been hurting me for 25 years straight or or whatever. Um so it's it's like a hard reset. Um you know, and it it just brings it can bring anxiety down greatly, um and on on a physical level. And you know, during the experiences, the the flood dose of IB gain during those experiences, um, and the experiences vary for everybody, but during those experiences, you might see your life flash before your eyes. A lot of people describe it as seeing a movie on their eyelids of everything they've been through or or even you know a lot of traumatic events, but it it has the ability to remove the emotion from it and give you perspective, yeah. You know, almost like you're you're watching it as a third party and and learning new things about it.
SPEAKER_01:Perspective is huge. Huge. Huge. Yeah. I mean huge. I've I've gone through therapy in the past and uh perspective really changes your outlook and understanding, and it helps you see it from the other angle, and I think a lot of veterans suffer from that.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. And you know, there's there's a lot of traumas that uh, you know, in a lot of ways, um, you know, definitely are not our fault, right? Childhood trauma, you know. If you're a kid and people are arguing around you or or or say something much worse, sexual abuse, stuff like that, that's never the person's fault. But what happens with Ibegain is you can see the pattern that develops from it. You know, what what what the the reaction that is meant to protect you in that moment starts to eat you alive later, that reaction becomes the the pattern that that destroys you moving forward. And that right there, you people are able to step into their power because they they understand, okay, this happened and I've been reacting to it this way, and now I don't have to do that anymore because I understand what happened. That's that's a lot of what you know on the spiritual side of the medicine, um, not necessarily the physical side, but the spiritual side that that is so beneficial for veterans, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. What do you what do you say to people? I because I just want to nip this in the butt right now. Uh, what do you say to people out there that are scared to do this?
SPEAKER_00:You know, it's it it can be a very it's totally normal to be scared. It's totally normal to have anxiety going into it because it's a big experience and it's a powerful, exotic West African psychedelic, you know, that that as of right now, people have to go to Mexico to do. Um, but you know, it's it it can be very life-changing, and the way that we work with it's very safely. You we have excellent ibegaine doctor, excellent staff, we do deep testing. Um this way it is a safe treatment, you know. I Ibegaine can be very dangerous if not done correctly, and if if if you know not correctly medically pre-screened, but you know, the way that we work with the medicine, um, you go into the experience in in an informed way where you know you're surrounded by people that are taking great care of you and just to observe and sit back and let it happen.
SPEAKER_01:So I think that's important to underline for people out there listening to make sure that you go with a trusted uh iber gain consultant. Um, how long have you guys been in business and what if you don't have to name them specifically, but what have some of your clients been like?
SPEAKER_00:Um, you know, we've we we started out primarily just treating a lot of addiction, and we've been around since 2018, and we're an extension of an earlier clinic. Um, you know, we've treat we treat everything from heavy-duty fentanyl detox to military veterans to first responders, um, police officers, and uh, you know, every everything in between. You know, uh it's some so many people need the medicine and need the help. Um working with veterans has been especially rewarding though, honestly. It's been very, very rewarding. Um rewarding for me and my whole staff.
SPEAKER_01:I I I really appreciate you working with veterans because I talk to a lot all the time and I personally know a lot that need the help.
SPEAKER_00:So yeah, yeah. And and y you know, there's the physical side that the medicine addresses, which is that activated state, that that that that just fight or flight mode that just stays turned on. There's the physical side and it addresses, but then there's this huge emotional offload, you know. And and Ibigain doesn't make you forget your trauma. It doesn't make you, you know, magically better, but it puts you into a place to do the work. So um, no, Ibegain is just the beginning of the process, if if that makes sense. And and and it puts you into a place of receiving it. I I can kind of go back to like all the rehabs I went to um before I got clean. I wanted to get clean, but I was in a really bad state. I'd sit in the rehab, and I wasn't ready to hear the information they were saying. And a lot of it was true, you know. After I began, I got into recovery because I was in a position to receive. And that's that's really what the medicine does for anybody who needs the help is it puts you into a non-activated state, whether you're a drug addict or a traumatized veteran. It yeah, you know, it puts you into a position to work on yourself with without it with and it helps turn that machine off that's running up here. And and yeah.
SPEAKER_01:That's it. I know I I know that machine you're talking about. Like I see it in so many people. Um growing up, I had a lot of childhood trauma as well, being uh military brat and a domestically violent uh situation growing up. Um and then having a mother and siblings, like this really hits home for me that I believe had some some mental issues. I really think that I could I would probably have a family today if we were more open-minded about the good qualities that this kind of treatment could possibly if we took a serious look at it, took politics out of it altogether, and actually took a good look at this stuff and said, what are the pros, what are the cons? Um, but there's a lot of red tape that gets in the way a lot of times, so this really hits home for me. You know, um Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And and it it it and it can help facilitate a lifestyle change. You know, when when when somebody gets out of that activated state or that extremely addicted state, and they start, you know, after after the medicine here, what we do, what makes us different than other clinics is you know, most of our clients stay longer than just one week here. You know, I've I've when I'm working with super hardcore addiction, guys stay a month, two months, three months. I've had clients stay six months. Um but so that the medicine puts you into this place of receiving where you're not, you know, activated, you're not craving. That's when the actual healing information comes in, whether it's it's you know, rehab information, recovery information, or or working through your trauma with with our psychologist. I have two clinical psychologists here that specialize in in trauma, trauma-informed therapy, and a licensed therapist here that specializes in trauma-informed therapy. It's really hard to go through that stuff when you're not okay, you know? So I begin gets you into a place where you are okay, and it gives you a window of time to really address things, and and it doesn't have to suck. It doesn't have to be a horrible experience. Oh, I gotta do therapy today, or oh, I gotta go to AA today, or oh, I gotta do this today. It's like, man, this is part of my practice now. This is part of my life. And it it just reframes it.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I think that's really important. So would you say that a lot of your clients are they're not shoved into this type of rehab. They have to mentally want to be there. Do you guys do any type of like pre-screening and have you like turned away folks before to say, hey, you're not ready yet?
SPEAKER_00:There's there's certain situations where where we have to turn people away. Um, there's certain mental conditions that are not really good with the medicine, schizophrenia is not good. There's certain cardiac conditions that um ivy gain can be very bad for. Um you know, and if there's kidney and liver function, but if if somebody's coming here for their wife or their parents or or for somebody else, it's pretty hard. Yeah. The the the people that come here want to come here typically.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I would imagine that you'd be kind of at the end of your rope because this is so non-traditional. It's kind of like seen as the VA. A lot of times folks don't go to the VA first, they go to other treatment places to get therapy, and then at the last resort, they're like, All right, I will give the Veterans Affairs a chance. And that's where I was at. Like, I literally avoided them for years, and it was kind of a last resort type of thing for me. But now that I understand the importance of therapy, meditation, I mean, even stretching, man, like I didn't realize I didn't realize the attachment of your central nervous system and all your past experiences, how that was attached to parts of your physical body. And I I had a somatic experience like when I was stretching once, um, because my I trained Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. Um cool. And so for me, yeah, but uh I'm an old man, so like I'm I'm having to stretch and stuff, and it's um uh keeping up with the young pups, but all of a sudden felt like so light, and my my mind just it was just a weird euphoric state. And I was like, what the hell's happened to me? And I was explaining it to a friend of mine, and she's like that you probably experienced a little bit of somatic um feeling, and so that's why having this conversation is is so important to me. Um for for folks out there that don't know, this came from West Africa, right? Do you know a little bit of history about it? Like where, like what were they using it for?
SPEAKER_00:Well, the the buidi, which is the spiritual practice in West Africa that works with it. A lot of people think it's a tribe or a a religion, it's really a spiritual practice. Um you know, there's there's some reports that the buidi have been working with the medicine since say 600 years ago. I personally feel it's been a lot longer. It's um, you know, basically the pygmy people in the in the forest in the jungle um have been eating iboga for millennia. And yeah, you know, as as that area was colonized by other Africans and then later uh, you know, Europeans and whatnot, it it developed into the the pygmies practice with the medicine developed into buy. So it's um it's a spiritual technology. Uh, and that you know, they they work with iboga, which is the medicine that, or the root bark, which is medicine that the ibogaine is typically extracted from. Um we get our ibogaine from other plants now, um, from that there's a plant called Volcanga, and it matures a lot faster than iboga. So what happens with it is iboga is a beautiful medicine. We work with iboga here a lot. I work with iboga a lot with our clients, but there's no reason to cut down and you know, or or harvest iboga for one alkaloid. Um, iboga has 14, maybe, maybe more alkaloids in it that all kind of fuse together. It's the whole plant. There's another plant that grows a lot faster called Vokanga. It matures in about a year. Um, and it grows all around iboga. So the ibogaine that we work with is ibogaine HCl. It's just pure ibogaine hydrochloride. It's Actually synthesized from Volcanine, which is from Volcanga. So, and and we do work with iboga, but I I see no reason to extract iboga, yeah, you know, ibegaine from iboga. It's and then the the volcanga, even though it's a semi-synthetic process it goes through, it doesn't feel like a synthetic. It's it's vibey and beautiful medicine and still from the same region.
SPEAKER_01:Fascinating. With you being down there, how often do you go through the process or the program yourself?
SPEAKER_00:Um, I try to do a flood dose every year or two of the medicine. I did a flood three months ago with our with our staff. It was great. It was great. We uh we just moved our flood clinic and our doctor was like, you need to experience it with here with us. So I did it and it was unbelievable. Um I try to do a flood every year or two. I do work with iboga more ongoing with our clients, so um, which is a completely different experience. Iboga is is you know, it can be the most psychedelic thing in the world, but in smaller doses, it just really brings you into a right now, clear and present state where it it kind of continues the deactivation that Ibegain does. It it brings you back to that place, and it's it's not about tripping or or or psychedelia in the in the kind of doses that I work with. Um it just turn it turns the ruminating off, it it drops you into a place of peace where you're very reflective and um not beating yourself up and and able to just continue working on yourself.
SPEAKER_01:So walk me through from start to finish. If somebody were to sign up for this, uh gen generally, what how what would that look like?
SPEAKER_00:Well, we we do our intake form with you know with with the guest and we go over their med list if they're on any meds. Um oftentimes, you know, a lot of a lot of veterans and first responders have been on certain antidepressants and things like that, or certain medications that conto indicate with ibogaine. So, you know, upon initial intake form, our doctor reviews it. I get in touch with them and say, hey, you know, okay, you want to come in, you have to be off this med for this long, this other med for this long. And that's that's if somebody wants to come in for like a an eight to 14 day program. Um so they'll have to cease taking certain meds at home, which can be kind of tough for certain people. Um and then, you know, a lot of my addiction clients are and and I treat a lot of veterans that are struggling with substance abuse, a lot of alcohol and and other other um, a lot of times there's war-related injuries where they're on oxy and things like that. So that that's that's kind of different. That's where we're detoxing everything out, we're getting them ready for treatment here. Um so the the med list isn't it's I mean, it's incredibly important because we know they're detoxing out, but you know, those are longer treatments. So typically they don't need to cease taking things before they arrive because they're gonna be here for a month or two months while we go through a more deep process. But with our shorter processes, um, you know, we go through the med lists, we verify that there's not like a heart history, pre-existing conditions that contraindicate with ibogaine, and then you know, the the time, the uh time gets booked. Um basically day one, arrival day, we do blood work, we do an EKG, and typically we'll start running IVs right away. Um so that that's just to kind of get somebody ready for treatment. People are just getting settled into so day one, day two, here while we're getting prepped for IV again, providing all the testing is good. Um we're running a lot of IVs, we do some integration groups. Um, people think of integration as something you do after a psychedelic medicine. Our integration starts before. It actually starts on the first call once, you know, because we start having the discussion. But, you know, we do intention setting, we do yoga here. Um, and typically we're running quite a bit of IBs to get people ready for treatment. Um, and then, you know, as we're moving through that process, that's that's say somebody's here two or three days, they come in in good health, then it's uh usually I begay day three or four, and we start our treatments at night, usually about 9 30. Um, doctor's present the whole time. Um they're in a beautiful space. There's you know, beautiful light projector on, amazing playlist. Our iBegain nurses are awesome. The doctor's on site the whole time, and they start the dosing about 9.30. Um, and you know, that our team's there to help them get up and go to the bathroom and and whatnot if they need need any assistance. And then as they're coming out of the treatment, usually starts to lighten up about five or six in the morning. So, and that's that's uh at that point we don't really know what their experience was like. We're and we're not they're not ready to talk about it yet, you know. So so typically 6 a.m., the experience is lightening up. Um, you know, we'll run a vitamin IV because it ibogaine can be pretty taxing on the body. So coming coming out of the treatment the next day they're just wiped out. And most people, we call it a gray day. So there's there's the the way I Ibogaine rebalances your dopamine and serotonin. Um, usually there's a pretty hard crash coming out of the treatment, and it it can be some of the most depressing thoughts people have ever had. It's just like the world's ending the next day. Some for some people, not everybody, but it's you know, we consider the gray day absolutely part of the medicine, and it's a reflective place. And then the staff is just there taking really good care of them, light food, make them some smoothies if they're hungry, and just kind of let that day unfold. Um the day after that, sometimes it's it's a little quick, but sometimes we'll do five MEO DMT, which is the toad medicine. A lot of people have heard about that or bufo. Life changing. It's you know, 20 minutes, 30 minutes, maybe 45 minutes to everybody's metab metabolizes things differently. But it has the ability to just break the ego down all the way and let let us see the truth. And that is that we're basically all one. It's uh I was an atheist before I did Buffo. So that's scary. It's scary. I kind of call my parents and apologize for everything after my first buffo. Yeah. But it's love. It's a you know, it's pure love, and that's that's something that that uh really helps the veterans a lot.
SPEAKER_01:That's how you heal, though, is you heal by seeing the truth and understanding that perspective.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. You know, God is everywhere. Yeah, I'm I tr not trying to get religious in your podcast, but then everything is made from God, and we're we're part of that, you know, and that there's there's definitely a super high intelligence. This is typically the message of Bufo for most people. Um that there's something much bigger than ourselves.
SPEAKER_01:And you know I've briefly spoken to people about it that have done this kind of thing before, and they all say the same thing too. Like just how much of an amazing experience and life-changing experience it was, and how it mentally set them free. I know a lot of veterans like myself, like every day I just feel very tight, like a tight piece of yarn, like a tight ball of yarn, just and then when I stretch, like that helps me get a little bit like more relaxed, more but I know that like internally I have a lot that I'm just keeping right here, you know, and with the daily and things like that, you we do our best to stay above water. Um, so that's why I I love talking about this sort of thing and discovery. I love discovery of this, but um, we didn't even mention where where are you located, and oh, absolutely talk about that.
SPEAKER_00:Like, what is that area like? We're in Rosarino, Mexico. It's about 40 minutes south of San Diego. All of our clients that are from the States fly to San Diego. Um, it's beautiful. It's you know, 30, it's a 30-second walk to the beach. Uh it's amazing, it's a beautiful, beautiful healing space. Uh, it's not tropical Mexico. Like it's I when I go outside today, I'm gonna have to wear a hoodie. It's uh we definitely get winter here. But so I always tell my clients that and they show up wearing flip-flops and shorts. I'm like, I hope you brought a hoodie during the cold. But um, it's amazing down here, it's very safe, very secure. Um you know, Mexico gets kind of a bad rap uh because stuff happens here. But um if you you know aren't in the bad touristy areas doing bad things, you don't have anything to worry about here.
SPEAKER_01:So do your clients typically get out or are they are they do they stay there on on site on property?
SPEAKER_00:They're with they're with us on site the entire time. Um I have two properties. I have a property in Ensenada, which is where our continuum of care is, our longer treatments, where we do sweat lodge. I have a full medical staff down here. I'm actually in Ensenada right now. Um we have a full medical staff. We do some pre-treatment here, but most of our pre-treatments are done at our flood clinic in Rizarrito. Um and both both facilities are amazing. One's one's a beach clinic, and then down here in Ensenada, we have what's called the villas, and it's a just a gorgeous villa in in the mountains. Um we have hot springs next door, we have a sweat lodge we do every Sunday on property. Um we have groups, uh, you know, daily check-ins. Um, I have you know, psychotherapists on staff here that does one-on-ones with our clients. Um it's amazing. And it's it's a place to just come unplug and and go through it, if that makes sense. You know, down here everybody's here to heal and try to get better. So we don't have to put on on our mask down here. We all everybody here knows, hey, yeah, we're all we're all dealing with something. What exactly is a sweat lodge? Oh, sweat lodge is a Native American, um, it's called a Temescal down here in the Mexican Mexican uh traditions. It is a Native American uh think of a teepee, but it's not a teepee. It's like an inepi is what it's called. It's like a dome. And we do uh, you know, there's a facilitator or a in our case a tomescalero, that's what she's called. Um it's a it's it's a ultra hot uh think of a sauna on steroids, but spiritual and therapeutic. So the way it works is they bring the rocks in, they heat the rocks in a fire out outside of the lodge, and they heat them for a couple of hours, and we do four doors. So they bring the rocks in and close the door, it's pitch black, and then you know, she starts talking and talking about what the sweat lodge is and and starts starts the process. And then they sing, she sings um Native American songs, Aztec songs, healing songs, and is is you know, um, it's it's good because the hotter it gets, you're singing with them. It's you know, and and what happens is the more you if you're singing, it's not as bad for you. Because the heat is keeping your mind distracted. You can always go to the yeah, and you can always go to the ground too. Um you know, the ground is cooler, so you can always lay down. You come out, it looks like you're covered in mud, basically, usually. Uh, but the this the sweat lodge is wild because you you know it people face their fears in there. You're dealing with claustrophobia, you're doing dealing with mental fears. Oh my god, this is hot. Is this gonna kill me? And it's not, it's very safe. Um, but it it also helps slow the mind down because you sit through it, you sit through the pain, and afterwards you feel great. There's you know, not all of our clients make it through the first door. You know, we we call it doors because you know, they'll sing two or three songs. The first door is usually not very hot, it's warm, and then you know, the door opens, cool air comes in, and then that she brings more rocks in. Then it starts to heat up even more, and you know, the door closes. So, as door three is like the nuclear door, by the way. You typically that's like heavy duty. Um, and and what's so crazy about the sweat lodge is you're like it it's not a pleasurable experience at first for most people. I was scared the first time I did one. I actually only made it through one door. I ran out of there. I was like, that's it, I can't do this. But over over the years and over just being here, it's become my very favorite medicine. And you know, it's not a something you take, it's not a psychedelic or anything. It's it's just a process. But um I think the sweat lodge has taught me the most, honestly. Because you're sitting in that discomfort, but then then you realize, wait a minute, this is great. You know, it's like earth medicine, pretty much.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it makes sense. I I was doing hot yoga for a while, and on a very it's a very small scale compared to what you're describing, but like Oh, that's not true.
SPEAKER_00:Really? I figured that out. Man, my my fiance, she she does hot yoga in San Diego. She she, you know, she took me with her one day, and I'm I'm sitting there thinking of my and I love yoga because I do it here. I'm sitting there thinking to myself, I do sweat lodge every week. This is no big deal. I I'm gonna sit, I'm gonna sit under the vent. Yeah. Oh buddy. About 50 minutes in. Let me tell you something. I had to tap out. Really? Oh yeah, but my ego got the best of me, and I learned that hot yoga, once that movement starts, it gets really hot. So I was all this is no big deal. It's a big deal.
SPEAKER_01:I I used to train at a uh MMA gym, and next door there was a hot yoga spot, and I thought I was always worried about getting injured. I was always worried, this is when I was much younger, I was always worried about injury and I need to stay like I need to be able to go to work. Um, and I just dabbled in it and ended up falling in love with it. The staff that worked there was great. And it it made me like focus on my breathing and take me it, it made me take myself somewhere else, and it reminded me a lot of my time in the military, whether you're on a really long ruck march and you'd be I'd I would take myself mentally somewhere else, or if I was deployed in Iraq, like I would take myself somewhere else at times just to stay mentally stable. Um and that's what I love about doing that sort of thing. And I the the sweat lodge sounded like an interesting uh an interesting thing, and I was just curious at how different that was versus Yahaw Yoga.
SPEAKER_00:It's you know, it's a lot hotter than hot yoga, but once the movement starts in hot yoga, hot yoga's hot. Yeah. Yeah, I figured that out. My ego got me. I said, Oh, I'm a big Tamascal guy, I do this all the time, and I sat right under the vent. Oh man. Definitely don't want to downplay it then, huh? Definitely not. I love I I go to hot yoga now when I'm in San Diego. I love it, but I I got a lot of respect for it.
SPEAKER_01:So I want to kind of tear down some of the myths, I guess, or concerns that people would have about something like this. And, you know, um, Ibergain is illegal in the in the U.S. Uh, what are some of the legal implications for veterans seeking treatment in Mexico, or are there any?
SPEAKER_00:There's none. There's none. Um, you know, and there's a lot of attention. There was just in waves of war just came out on Netflix about uh veterans coming down here for Ibigaine. Um there's a lot of of political stuff going on with Ibogaine in the states right now. There's a lot of stuff in Texas um and Arizona. There was a bill passed in Arizona um for funding research at the state house level. And what and I I can say this publicly, it's really cool. Senator Mark Finchin from Arizona actually came out here and experienced the medicine after after they passed the law. We have him and I have some mutual friends, great guy. And he's he's a retired police officer now, he's a state senator. Um he went through the process to to maybe deal with like some football concussions because I begin can help with TBI. So he he just wanted to experience what he what he helped you know get researched and is helping get researched in Arizona. And um it's going to be in the states. It's gonna be in the states one way or another. Um timelines, there's it could be maybe available to some in the states in as fast as a year in certain situations. I think to build out the complete infrastructure is gonna take quite a while. Um but I do foresee in the next 12 to 24 months they're at the very minimum being veteran and and trauma PTSD programs opening up in the states with ibigay.
SPEAKER_01:That would be beautiful to start seeing some alternative treatments because like I said, we're we're doing the same thing over and over again, getting the same results. You you give somebody a different prescription, they get addicted to that, then they get addicted to something else. And you know, what's good for one is not always good for all. And I think that we need to open this up, you know.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and and and you know, it it it can really help facilitate uh a state of being for people. Um you know, and that that that is why we we tend to gravitate towards the longer treatments, because we can, you know, curate and get get our our visitors in to other healing stuff, other healing modalities that's gonna help them moving forward. Because you can't just take ibogaine cannot be used as a recreational drug. There's no risk of it becoming an addictive substance. It's the opposite of addiction. Um, which that that's that's what was really cool about Senator Fincham being here is he went through the process and afterwards he looked at me, he said, There's no recreational use for this. He he was maybe I don't know if he was worried or concerned about it, but he he definitely verified to himself that there was no potential for abuse of the medicine um in in in an addictive way. But the the the medicine really can just help facilitate a place to start because it creates neuroplasticity in the brain. So if you're doing these healing activities after in in that neuroplastic state and you're you're doing the work on yourself, it becomes part of your habit. It becomes part of your your your program stack. And and that goes for anybody, you know, suffering with any condition, whether it be addiction, trauma, PTSD, depression, all the above, you know, it's it it it it it adds a newness to life that is you only feel a few times in life, you know. I I I forgot that newness that those the the you know the the first time I ever felt that kind of newness, I was maybe 16, I got my first car, you know, and I was out driving around town as a free human being. Yeah, you know, that that sense of freedom. And the next, the very next time I ever felt that sense of freedom was. After Ibegain. That brand new, wow, this world is amazing. There's new stuff to do. There's so much to you know out there, that brand new feeling. That Ibegain really can help facilitate that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that I mean, I it's amazing that one of our political leaders actually stepped out and instead of just judging it by hearsay, went out and tried it for himself, did his own research. And I also want to mention too that Senator Fincham is a a uh former first responder. Yep. Um and then you said he also played football too.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, he played football as a young guy and you know, had some concussions and stuff like that. Um, you know, and Iby gain does a lot for TBI. That's that's the thing. And they're they're they're doing a lot of research right now on it. Um but it it it creates neural growth factor in the brain. Uh it also turns the voltage up in the brain, which can help reconnect neurons that have been knocked offline. So it's it there's there's a lot of mechanisms of action with the medicine they don't fully understand, but they will understand soon. Um but the results with the traumatic brain injury has been unbelievable. Um, you know, people who've suffered a lot of concussions and and head trauma, they have mood disorders, they have bipolar, rapid depression, things like that. Ibegaine really appears to be able to help it a lot of the time. And yeah, yeah, and neurological stuff. There's a lot of evidence that it can help Parkinson's disease or at least the symptoms from Parkinson's. Um, I'm not gonna say it's a cure for it. I think they're they're they're doing investigative findings on it right now. But what it what it does for traumatic brain injury is amazing and how it's all tied together, you know, the TBI can be tied with OCD, tied with depression, tied with rapid mood swings, and then, you know, the trauma state that people are in, the PTSD state, just exasperates it or creates it, or it all is one thing, and Ibegain has the ability to interrupt it, just like it interrupts addiction. So Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I'm into the research, man, as long as it's safe. But yeah, how do you how do you handle the confidentiality for service members, government employees, or veterans who might fear stigma or like career impact for this kind of thing?
SPEAKER_00:Well, the the HIPAA laws in Mexico, it's not called HIPAA here, are actually more serious than the HIPAA laws in the States. So, you know, I I I've treated a lot of, you know, I was able to, you know, talk about Senator Mark Finchin because he's he came here to be public about it. But the the privacy is our of our utmost concern here, and we don't disclose who our clients are. I've treated people from all walks of life and all spectrums, and it's that's it.
SPEAKER_01:That's that's true leadership for that senator to not only just do it but be open about it and let others know too, because that kind of opens up the gates um for others out there who's gonna be able to do that.
SPEAKER_00:He's a great guy. He's a great guy. He uh uh my friend Boone Cutler, uh who he passed away recently, unfortunately, um worked with him and was his good friend and brought him down here.
SPEAKER_01:So sorry to hear that. Sorry to hear loss about your friend. I when you mentioned him the other day, I looked him up and uh was reading a little bit about him, so I'm sorry about the loss.
SPEAKER_00:What a great guy. Boone is a great guy, and he's he's working from the other side now. That's how we look at it.
SPEAKER_01:So what advice would you give uh a veteran who's considering treatment but hesitant to cross the border or try something outside of mainstream media?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, you know, being being down here in Mexico for close to eight years now, I can tell you there's a lot of hype about the crime down here. There's a lot of misinformation. This isn't a beautiful country down here. Um and you know, the stuff that people hear about's not just happening every day everywhere here. It's uh, you know, and we're and where we're located. It's not um there's not that kind of issue, yeah. You know, uh a lot of times people hear about tourists or or whatever having problems, which is very minimal, actually. Uh those are guys going into bars in Tijuana, drinking a bunch, acting stupid. It would be kind of like going to Compton and acting dumb. That's sort of what happens down here. And uh yeah, definitely not. And you know, uh the the cartel stuff, from what I can tell and see, uh they're not just targeting regular people. I don't think it's good for their business.
SPEAKER_01:Right. It is a very business business uh organization, business driven.
SPEAKER_00:And uh a lot of a lot of the crime people hear about, not not to change the subject too much, a lot of the crime people hear about in this country is really like the same crime in the States, you know, broke people addicted to hard drugs, methamphetamine in Mexico quite a bit, living in abandoned houses. Tweakers, honestly. I used to be one. Um from what I see, those those that's who you have to worry about here, and usually you have to go around them for that to be a problem.
SPEAKER_01:Well, God bless you for pulling yourself out of that, man, and and being able to look in the mirror. But uh what a knock down some of the other um things that people may have questions about, and you briefly went over it earlier, but um ibergain uh is known cardiac, to have cardiac and medical risk, but what safeguards, medical screening, protocols, and emergency resources do you have in place for veterans going through this treatment?
SPEAKER_00:Well, our doctor is an emergency physician and surgeon who's been working with ibogaine since 2006. So he he is he's just amazing in in emergencies, and and we don't see him very often. Um as far as the treatment itself goes, safeguards, once somebody's cleared, we run magnesium pretreatment. There's been a lot of research on that. Stanford did something uh recently. We've been working with magnesium and ibogaine forever. Uh, you know, the blood work that's done tells tells us what the electrolyte balances are. But as a prophylactic to any potential cardiac issues, he typically does run magnesium pretreatment, uh, like in a little hundred ml bag. And, you know, depending on where their levels are, he'll run maybe one gram. Maybe I've seen him run as much as six grams pre-treatment, which is quite a bit. Um, and it's it's very safe. Uh, you know, we recently I had a veteran here recently, great guy. Um, we detected a potential cardiac block in on his heart. And he had he had had uh multiple EKGs before coming, but it had been maybe since, well, I guess July was his last one, and they didn't detect it. So we ran another EKG and it came up again. So with that, we were like, we don't know if we're gonna be able to treat him. So our doctor then had him go get a deeper analysis on his heart with a specialized cardiologist. And it turned out there's a blockage, but it wouldn't be problematic for Ibigaine, and we were able to treat him. So sometimes we have to do further investigation, and sometimes that further investigation equals no treatment. Um, and in in which case there are other medicines we can work with, there's other stuff that we do here, you know, uh program-wise, but most of the time we're able to do the treatment.
SPEAKER_01:So And who is typically not a good candidate for iber gain and and are there conditions or or medications that would immediately rule somebody out for this?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, any SSRI has to be out of their system pretty much. Um schizophrenia. Ugh, there's my dog here. He's just the same way. You know, severe heart, heart, heart conditions. Um we have treated people that have had bypasses. They're just, you know, we have to do deep investigation on the heart. Um, kidney liver function is a big deal. We see impaired liver frequently because we detox, you know, hard drugs and a lot of alcohol. Um, but and what that usually looks like is the liver numbers will be somewhere when they come in. The doctor will start running IVs and and you know, do doing necessary things to bring those numbers down, and then we'll run another blood test later and see if those numbers are coming down, if the liver is actually functioning correctly. And if if they're not coming down, maybe we have to go do a scan of the liver to make sure there's no cirrhosis scarring and stuff. Um there's CT scan, and then there's another test that they do. I can't remember the name of it. Um, so you know, a lot of it's investigative. Typically, we are able to treat people um that have come in in compromised states because typically it's because of addiction, alcohol, and drugs. So, you know, as they're eating healthy and we're running IVs and they're not doing those terrible substances, we see their body renormalize. Um so yeah, the medications that are also contraindicated, any stimulant at or all, no good, um, can kill you. So we have to get all that out of their system. Um, basically every antidepressant, depending on which one it is, like uh most of them is like fifty, like well buterin, we have to have guys off for 15 days before treatment, um, which a lot of people can just stop taking at home. Sometimes if they're on a high dose, they have to do a slow taper or a pretty rapid taper and then cease it. Um and then there's other times where maybe they can't stop taking it at home because they're afraid it's gonna upset their life. So they come here to go through that process and you, you know, in a safe container.
SPEAKER_01:Sounds like you really care and you're really putting yourself at a cornerstone to be a reputable source for this sort of thing, and you're taking a lot of the precautions. What are the misconceptions or fears do veterans or just people in general bring with them before treatment? And how do you how do you address those?
SPEAKER_00:Big fear is Mexico. That's a huge fear, and that's that's the number one fear. And, you know, uh, and it's a fear of family members too, typically. So um, you know, other fears about the medicine is this gonna change me? You know, is this gonna make me not like the things that I like? That's something I hear sometimes. And if it does, maybe that's what needed to happen, you know? Like when when I got clean, I I thought I was getting clean um to go back to music. And something happened, and I said, wait a minute. I don't want to do that now. And I I love music and I like to play, I play a bunch of instruments, but I changed my life and career. So um other fears about the medicine, um there's there's a lot. Other other fears that I see commonly about the medicine, everybody has anxiety going into it, which is healthy and completely normal, you know. Even even when I do a flood, I I get I'm nervous before we we do it. Not not because I'm worried I'm gonna die or anything like that. I know I began and iboga are very safe with my body. It's uh it's it's a heavy process. You know, it's it's it's there's there's it's good to have a little healthy, healthy anxiety and fear about it.
SPEAKER_01:So Yeah, um something like this, it's kind of like walking into the unknown, so I could see where people would would but again if you're at the end of your rope or you're you know, I can tell you that it took me many years to to process that I was the common denominator in a lot of things. Um and I, like many veterans out there, came from a broken home, um, had issues prior to going into the military, and then the military just added more to that, and then um deployment, war, all that stuff coming back here, dealing with the transition of you know, coming back to being a normal citizen again or normal person, you know, was uh was difficult for me. And uh how do you do that integration afterwards? Is it just like all of a sudden, all right, this is day 14 and it's time to go home? How do you wind that down to get people to come back?
SPEAKER_00:Well, we we have uh alumni support groups here, we have an alumni call once a week. Um we have continuing integration that we do with our clients when they leave. But a lot of the integration post-IV, and that's why we like to do longer stays, is because you come out of this really powerful medicine, which is you know, life-changing, but by the time somebody's getting on the plane to go home, maybe they're still half in it, you know, at a lot of these other clinics that are doing five and seven-day treatments. And I'm not saying we don't do seven-day treatments, we can and we do them sometimes. Um, sometimes that's all somebody could do, but it's all in the prep. Um we really prefer to do the longer treatments because this is a good place to land, a good place to process what just happened, a good place to have perspective. And uh, you know, another another big thing that uh happens here is there's community and connection. And a lot of the people that are coming here, whether they're veterans, first responders, or or addicts, have been disconnected, you know, disconnection, they isolate. So here there's there's a community setting where you're with other people and you know, everybody has a common goal to heal. And it can be up and down, it's a whole thing, but uh that connection is part of the medicine to me. It's it's one of the most important parts, is being able to connect with with others and and and not isolate anymore, you know.
SPEAKER_01:You know, Andrew, uh, there's one other question I want to ask you before we finish up the podcast, and um, it has to do with another uh psychedelic treatment that I've heard, and it's called ayahuasca. How is that different from iborgaine?
SPEAKER_00:I ibigain is uh uh a completely different molecule. It's from from you know plants in Africa typically. Uh ayahuasca is a tea or a brew that contains DMT and then a MAOI inhibitor, which makes the DMT orally active. So ayahuasca doesn't have the same level of cardiac risk that Ibogaine has, but it can be a very, very deep experience for people. Um and it's a different kind of psychedelic. They don't feel the same or have some of the similar characteristics, really. Um ayahuasca is almost a feminine energy. A lot of people describe ibogaine as a very masculine energy, very factual. Um, ayahuasca can be very emotional, and it uh it's life-changing. It changed my life. Um we do work with ayahuasca here for our clients that are staying longer. It's not safe to do it too close to Ibogaine, they can contraindicate with each other. I have an ayahuasca facilitator that lives on site here. She's also a licensed therapist. Um, she trained in Ecuador in the jungle. Uh but ayahuasca is a very deep medicine when done, you know, in the right setting with the with the right um container, you know, safety container. It um people come out of the ceremonies changed. It's it's uh um beautiful, beautiful medicine. And it's it can be different, you know. Maybe there's not visuals, maybe you transport to another dimension or into your higher self or other versions of yourself. It's it's it's almost quantum in a way, uh, if that makes sense. Um but ayahuasca is very, very healing and um you know has very positive health effects.
SPEAKER_01:So determining whether someone needs iber gain versus ayahuasca, that's part of the pre-screening process?
SPEAKER_00:It is. And at this at the same time, like our clients that are coming for like a month, two months, sometimes we're able to work with both. We work with ayahuasca towards the end of their stay. Um, and you know, the the thing with medicines like ayahuasca is it's it's a lot more prominent than ibogaine. A lot more people know about ayahuasca in the world. Um you know, with the with the clientele that we work with, it's best. Um you know, you really need to know your facilitator. And our our facilitator has been here for six and a half years working with traumatized addicts, traumatized veterans. Um, you know, there there can be ego with certain ayahuasca facilitators or shaman, as a lot of them, and there are shaman in the world, you know, in the jungle in Peru and in indigenous lineages. But um our our facilitator, her name's Julie, she works with ayahuasca in a very intentional, beautiful way. She sings for eight hours straight in a room with a fire and candles, and you know, I I tend to have a nurse, a nurse or two, depending on the size of the ceremony, out in the background very quietly to help people get to and from the bathroom. But Ibigain's done in a group setting here. Or not Ibigain, ayahuasca is done in a group setting, and it's uh it's a journey in into yourself and into um letting go. And it can get dark and and and it can process a lot of heavy information, but it also can be the most love-connecting experience ever.
SPEAKER_01:So fascinating. It's fascinating to hear.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. That's beautiful, beautiful menace.
SPEAKER_01:I know for me that that connection that you're talking about, um, for me coming back and having to sit at the table with others that didn't uh share my same experiences, and then a lot of people today watch a lot of social media, they watch a lot of news, so then they gain these like strong beliefs and judgments on the way things it are. And like you mentioned about Mexico, I always say this that the answer is really somewhere in the middle. Like from what you're hearing and what you're seeing, especially on social media and in the news, it's not left or it's not extreme right. It's kind of somewhere in the middle, and that's really where it is, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And you know, the wild thing is there are things about Mexico that are so much better than the states. And then there's things about the states that are so much better than Mexico. If you could combine the two, the best of both, wow, you'd have utopia, in my opinion. You know, I'm telling I learned to I I learned to be humble here in Mexico, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Talking to a guy that was that's from the states and now you're living down there, so yeah, I mean, you would know more than most. Um from your perspective, what changes need to happen in the U.S. healthcare system to better support veterans with addiction and PTSD?
SPEAKER_00:You know, um everything. Uh one thing I've encountered quite a bit, and then just from treating a lot of veterans, is a lot of them will tell me they have a good therapist at the VA. Some of them don't like their therapist or don't like the particular VA they're going to. But I've I've encountered many that are like, look, the therapist or the psychologist I have at the VA really cares, is really good. They're just handcuffed. They they can't, you know. A lot of times I have guys here where the the person at the VA might have said, Hey, go try Ibogaine, or hey, you need psychedelics. We just can't work with it yet. That that happens. So they're there from what I can tell and what I've seen, there are some great people working at the BA. Um, they're just handcuffed. And you know, if this process can get normalized into the states, uh on the trauma PTSD side, healthcare system-wise, you know, they need to get away from the antidepressants, away from the the big pharma stuff. And again, I'm not saying every prescription medication is evil or bad. There are certain ones that are for certain things that are necessary. Um, but they really over-prescribe antidepressants. They really do. Uh, I think maybe one in a hundred needs them. Um, other issues, schizophrenia, that that requires medication, you know, and that that's that's that's serious stuff. It's a it's hardware, hardware issues in the brain, um, for the most part. But you know, on the trauma PTSD depression side, I think they need to look at the whole whole system. They need to um take a holistic approach working with these medicines. Um now on the detox side, big changes have to happen in the in the actual healthcare system itself. Um you know, the way that we work with ibogaine, if somebody's on a maintenance med like methadone or suboxin, which a lot of people are on, uh you can't do ibogaine. We have to transition over to oxy or to morphine while we detox that stuff out. Same with fentanyl. You don't want to put ibogaine in somebody's system that has fentanyl in their system. It's at best, it doesn't get rid of the withdrawals. At worst, it can cause a severe heart complication. So, you know, d dealing deal the the the American medical system is gonna have to restructure its opiate laws surrounding addiction in order to actually bring the process to the states that we do.
SPEAKER_01:Right. To get rid of the band-aids and find the real solutions is what it sounds like.
SPEAKER_00:Exactly. And and you know, the doctors, the doctors have been handcuffed in the states, you know. You had the big Purdue pill problem.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_00:And yeah, then they they pulled it, and then everybody had to turn to the street per cassettes, which are just fentanyl. And now you have a whole generation of people on fentanyl um dying by the millions. They say hundreds of thousands, I think it's the millions. Um, it's really bad. And that that's because they went from being able to over-prescribe meds to not prescribe them at all. There, there has to be some logic used. Yeah, you know. Portugal has done some great stuff uh with their medical system and their drug laws, and they've had great results. And then you have other places like Canada or Portland that did not do what Portugal did. They've done something different with drug laws and it's caused a crisis. So it's wild. If if if the states really wants to be able to address addiction, I think taking the Portugal law and translating it into English and just doing it would be great. It's already working. It's working fantastically. Don't do what Vancouver did, don't do what Portland did. Portland just like blanket made it okay to do fentanyl. And Vancouver, uh, same thing, basically. They actually prescribe you drugs and then pay for a place and then give you money, and it's it's horrible. Well, that's not the same thing as what Portugal did, but to to really get this process into the States, it I think it's gonna be easiest for trauma, PTSD, depression for veterans, first responders, and and people struggling with mental. Um for detox, it's gonna require heavy, heavy uh changes in the way doctors are able to work and what they're able to prescribe without going to jail or losing their medical license.
SPEAKER_01:So you know, I never understood that because everyone all across the world, we're all human beings. And why are there different drug, food, FDA, and whatever else every other country's why is there different regulations for every country? Like if it's good for someone in Portugal, if it's good for someone in Germany, why is it not good for someone in America? Like we exactly humans.
SPEAKER_00:Right? If the data is good, if the data is good over there, just take their law, translate it to English, and and it it's already proven. Yeah, you know, if the race horses winning the race, you want that horse in the next race.
SPEAKER_01:When I used to travel abroad and I would eat at like restaurants, sometimes fast food restaurants, they weren't allowed to serve certain things. And I thought, well, why can they serve it in the United States, but they can't serve it here? Um, like what is safe and what is not safe? We're all human beings, we all have the same organs, same brain, same everything. Like, what's what's the real answer to this? And that that was the one thing that I think throughout the years, I've always looked at and said, What the hell? You know, but and it I want to mention this too. It sounds like you tailor a lot of your programs based off the individual, what if their availability, what they exactly need. So if they're there, they're not locked in for 45 days. They may be seven, 10, 15, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And and and and a lot of guys come out, a lot of people come out where maybe they book 10 days, and at day nine, they look at us, they go, Man, I need more time here. That happens a lot. And it's like, okay, cool. You know, this, this, this way, they they come, they get they get to start with the medicine, they start their process, they're getting good results, and then they can extend. And that that that happens quite a bit. Um, because it it's a big decision to go to a country that's been bashed in the media to do a psychedelic that can be potentially very dangerous, very uh if not done correctly. Um, it's a big thing. It's a it's a you have to be desperate for a lot of people, you know. Yeah. For anyone out there to take these steps.
SPEAKER_01:For anyone out there that's interested in doing more research themselves, um, where are you guys at on social media? How can they do more research to figure out if this is for them?
SPEAKER_00:Our Instagram is Freedom Ibegain, or it's yeah, Freedom Ibegain. And our website is simple, it's freedomIbegain.com. There's a lot of good video on our Instagram of both of our facilities so people can kind of see where they're gonna be at, lots of testimonials and stuff with our staff. Um, and our website has some good information, you know. If if they want to talk to me, just give us a call and they'll they'll get me on the phone.
SPEAKER_01:So you were very easy to get a hold of, and um, I really that's refreshing because a lot of times you go through bots and things like that. But uh yeah, it was nice to actually just get to just get a hold of someone and and to get some information. And for anyone out there that's listening, you mentioned athletes, people with childhood trauma, trauma in general, veterans, first responders, anyone out there that's listening right now and has that feeling of hopelessness, they're stuck or ashamed. Andrew, what what would you tell them directly?
SPEAKER_00:That it's gonna get better. This too shall pass, and the the first thing that has to happen is you gotta establish connection somehow. You know, you have to find people to be around and talk to that that that that you feel comfortable with. Um you know, it's about community and connection. That's we we we are be we are communal creatures, and you know, you're you're not alone, you know, even though you feel like it. I've felt alone before.
SPEAKER_01:Very and it's it's a dark place. I always say I always say that um since I've been doing Brazilian jujitsu for so many years, that's kind of been my community, my family. Um been to so many gyms, trained with so many. I've been blessed to stand in the same room with some of the best, most professional tacticians, um fighters in the world, man. And it's it's all about putting yourself in and surrounding yourself with the right people, um, but also having that self-awareness and accountability, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. And exactly. And and you know, uh, I'm I'm sure you realize if you get out of practice, things slide back, you know? And that that's the thing here is what what we're trying to do is just start the fire and start the practices and get it moving. But it's just like working out, yeah. You know, uh mental health is too. If you stop doing the things that take care of yourself, or if you keep putting them, oh I'll do that tomorrow. I'm so I'm doing that right now with going to the gym, by the way. Not good, I'm gonna work out today. But if you you know, things can slide back, and next thing you know, you're back to square one. Um, but the medicine does change people. It it it does, it gives you those that at least a knowledge that it can be better, even if you slide back. You know, it's a process. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So was there anything that I didn't mention on this podcast today, Andrew, that you'd like to mention before we round things out?
SPEAKER_00:I think you've covered it all, man. Really. I I really I really appreciate you having me on. It's been really nice. I I get nervous on podcasts and doing public speaking, but this has been very, very good.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, at the end of the day, it's just a conversation. I'm I'm generally and inherently curious too, because I know what it's like to walk that path of feeling and and failing and having to look in the mirror and realize that I'm the common denominator here. I need to fix something about myself. So I really it's an honor to have spoken to you today and and to talk about this specifically. And I I hope that this helps others. I really I wanted to do this because I think that we do have a crisis in our country. I think that coming out of 20-year wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, um, there's a lot of um non-treatment that's going on, a lot of things that are not processed. I know a lot of veterans personally, I know a lot of first responders personally that suffer in silence. And so I hope that our words today can get out there and help someone else to rehabilitate themselves, man, and just come back to the table and and you know, live a healthy life. I think that's the most important is to live a healthy life mentally and physically.
SPEAKER_00:That is the most important because when you're living a healthy life, you feel good. And yes, there's gonna be bad days. There's always gonna be bad days, but there's gonna be a lot more good days than bad days if you're living healthy and living right. And, you know, and I and if you equip yourself with the tools to move through that. That's that's what I figured out for myself at least.
SPEAKER_01:So everyone else out there, Formation Nation, listen, today's conversation wasn't about promoting a cure necessarily. It's about exploring options, asking the hard questions, bringing light to the shadows, uh, to our veteran community who often carry their load alone. Healing is not one size fits all. It's every warrior's path is gonna look different, every warrior's treatment is gonna look different. And I hope that's what you discovered today. And hopefully we broke down some of the barriers and some of the myths out there to help you do a little more exploration, a little more research. And to our guest, again, Andrew, thank you for shedding light on the topic. That's very thank you. It's very complex, it's controversial, and deeply needed uh in our first responder and military community. And to everyone listening, as always, I want you to stay tuned, stay focused, and stay motivated. Warriors, fall out.